Underwhelmed by Macromedia Flash 8
Tuesday, 13 September 2005Never one to be afraid of going against popular opinion, I have to say that I’m more than a little disappointed with Macromedia Flash 8. While we have heard all about the new features of the Flash Player, the only news that I’ve head about the IDE was improved stability and a properly functioning Library panel. I was hoping that Macromedia had a few surprises up their sleeve. I was disappointed.
One of the things that I’ve been secretly hoping for is a component set that’s on a par to the one that ships with Flex. I always felt slightly neglected knowing that Flex developers get properly working, sexy and efficient components. Those who bought Flash MX 2004 Professional had to put up with a component set that didn’t quite measure up, either functionally or aesthetically.
Unfortunately Flash 8 Professional only ships with the same V2 components that we got with MX 2004. Given the small increase in the minor version number (2.0.2.x vs. 2.0.1.x) I presume that the new ones have been given the once over, and for that I suppose I should be grateful. But it’s a hard pill to swallow when I was looking forward to layout containers and a Tree component that supports drag and drop operations, amongst other delights.
Another disappointment was the omission of a command-line compiler. With Macromedia conceding that most people are using external editors to write their ActionScript code, I can’t understand Macromedia not providing such a tool. It would take some killer features to make me switch away from MTASC for most of my Flash work, purely because of the productivity increases I get from a command-line compiler.
It’s not all bad, though. One positive I’ve found is that the IDE seems much more responsive on a Mac than its predecessor. I’ve only had a few minutes to play with it today, but I was very pleased with the performance here. Of course, it remains to be seen if it’s still as crash prone as its predecessor. And the new features supported by Flash Player 8 - particularly file upload - are going to make a big difference to the user experience for Flash applications.
In summary, whilst I’m pleased with the advancements made in the Flash Player, the new IDE offers very little. It feels more like a bug fix release than a major release, which I guess is the root of my disappointment. I rarely use the IDE these days except for creating the raw assets for my applications, and I can’t justify buying Flash 8 Professional just for that purpose. With MTASC I can take advantage of the new features and speed increases in the Flash Player and all the other benefits of the Flash Platform, but without having to pay over the odds for an upgrade.
Hmm, the new authoring tool is more of a visual
John Dowdell | Tuesday, 13 September 2005 | 10:30 pmHmm, the new authoring tool is more of a visual environment… it sounds like you’re seeking features which are more coding-specific… if so, then have you read up on Zorn yet?
http://weblogs.macromedia.com/mesh/archives/2005/08/will_zorn_requi.cfm
John: I'm very excited about Zorn, but my guess would
Steve | Tuesday, 13 September 2005 | 10:44 pmJohn: I’m very excited about Zorn, but my guess would be that it’s at least 12 months away from being delivered to us little folk.
We all knew that this release of Flash was being targeted at designers who themselves had been neglected in previous releases. I’m happy with that. I just wanted a little more for us developers too.
My biggest disappointment is that despite the Flex components already having been written and tested, Macromedia have decided that Flash 8 Professional isn’t ‘professional’ enough to include them. Because out client base would balk at the cost of a Flex server license we’re left out in the cold. Our main product at work is a Flash RIA that is suffering because the V2 component set is inefficient and/or not feature rich enough. Unfortunately it’s the best we have at the moment because all of the third party component sets seem to be missing one or two key components, and we sure as hell don’t have enough time to write our own.
Hi there, There are a few other smaller features related to
Jen | Tuesday, 13 September 2005 | 10:53 pmHi there,
There are a few other smaller features related to AS development in the IDE noted here.
http://livedocs.macromedia.com/flash/8/main/00001132.html
Hey i feel the same about the components thing. It`s
Benjamin | Tuesday, 13 September 2005 | 11:55 pmHey i feel the same about the components thing. It`s just sad that we still have to work with an outdated component set. What makes me looking forward is the statement that the flex developer team has now control over the component development and that they are in a different development cycle than the flex team. For me that meana that the new components are just around the corner and will be available to flash with the release of flex 2.0/Zorn. I just hope that it will be a free update rather than another expensive update. If you look atv the new features of the flash player you`ll find many new possiblities for a component api. I think it would be even more painfull if they would have included an updated V2 component set that would have been replaced in 1/2 a year by the new fancy bitmap… using V3 components. So i see this as a chance for us (flash developers) to eventually get the same components than flex has. I even think that macromedia may have changed their policy concerning updates in general. It all started with the 7.2 update (Ellipsis). That was the first update between a major product cycle. And now look at the E4X feature. They skiped it and said it will be released later. I doubt that this means we have to wait till flash 9. I hope for a 8.5… realease. It´s much easier to tell you clients that you need 8.5 than to tell them you`ll need 9
O.K. you see you touched me with this thread. I`m very pleased with flash 8 but at the same time a bit disappointed because it`s not the huge step for us developers - but look at all the hidden possibilities!
Flash (not Flex) is still the number one in RIA development and MM knows that. Although i would call myself a RIA developer don`t forget were we come from. I just love the new bitmap stuff and possibilities. I would love a new wave of andies odendaals and yugops but sure i`m afraid of a new skip intro period. Last thing i`m confident that we`ve all learned our lesson and everything will work out great.
Looking forward for V3 components!
Bye
Benz
Flash 8's ActionScript Editor can now add breakpoints to external
Robert Penner | Wednesday, 14 September 2005 | 12:21 amFlash 8’s ActionScript Editor can now add breakpoints to external .as files.
Hi, "I’m very excited about Zorn, but my guess would be
David Mendels | Wednesday, 14 September 2005 | 1:27 amHi,
“I’m very excited about Zorn, but my guess would be that it’s at least 12 months away from being delivered to us little folk.”
Bad guess
Lots of news in the nearer term.
-David
Macromedia
I'm sure I heard it said several times that there
Keith Peters | Wednesday, 14 September 2005 | 5:01 amI’m sure I heard it said several times that there would be no major component updates (beyond the media component) in Flash 8, and I never heard a whisper about a command line compiler. On the other hand, there are pages and pages of cool features that have been heavily promoted for many months.
David: In this instance I'm very happy to be wrong.
Steve | Wednesday, 14 September 2005 | 8:58 amDavid: In this instance I’m very happy to be wrong. If Zorn appears within 3-6 months (and it comes with a decent component set) I’ll be a very happy developer!
Keith: I’ve never seen a categorical statement saying that we wouldn’t be getting updated components in this release. I asked the question of various members of the developer relations team, all of who declined to reply at all. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect a top-notch component set to ship with Macromedia’s flagship product.
Almost all of the cool features you mention are actually Flash Player features, not advancements within the IDE. The only advances in the IDE that I can see myself benefiting from are improved stability and a library panel that actually works. For me, that’s not worth the upgrade price.
Yeah, the IDE didn't change much (aside from being faster,
Keith Peters | Wednesday, 14 September 2005 | 12:36 pmYeah, the IDE didn’t change much (aside from being faster, more stable and more useable). This release concentrated on a few specific areas, mainly expressiveness features. The component question was answered several times, very plainly, and repeated on a number of blogs/sites. Obviously it wasn’t something they were going out of their way to advertise, but whenever I heard the question asked, it was answered with “no”.
Keith: As I said above, I've never seen the component
Steve | Wednesday, 14 September 2005 | 1:34 pmKeith: As I said above, I’ve never seen the component question answered by anyone from Macromedia. If they did then great, but it doesn’t change the fact that we have to put up with substandard components.
I know I should stop bitching and go and write my own, but that’s besides the point. Macromedia has the Flex components already design, written and tested, and yet they chose not to include them in this release. If they made that decision because Zorn will fill that void then I’ll take it all back, but only if Zorn doesn’t cost an arm and a leg like Flex does. Until that time I stand by all that I’ve said above.
There are some 3rd party UI component sets out there
Brian Randall | Wednesday, 14 September 2005 | 8:20 pmThere are some 3rd party UI component sets out there that are apparently pretty good, although they are not exacly free:
here’s one that Grant Skinner’s team (I think) did:
http://www.metaliq.com/mcom/
(here’s a link to Grant’s comments and some developer feedback: http://www.gskinner.com/blog/archives/2005/09/mcom_glic_compo.html)
And - coincidentally - Keith made a set of components that were provided by Beam Jive Consulting, but then got bought by FlashLoaded - and currently their site is down for some reason:
http://www..flashloaded.com/
Also check out these sites that collect various compontents by various developers:
http://www.flashcomponents.net/
http://www.flashcomponent.com/components.php
okay, I had the wrong page on the bit component
Brian Randall | Wednesday, 14 September 2005 | 8:22 pmokay, I had the wrong page on the bit component set. Here’s the correct link:
http://www.flashloaded.com/bitcomponents.php
Brian: Unfortunately both of those component sets are each lacking
Steve | Wednesday, 14 September 2005 | 8:35 pmBrian: Unfortunately both of those component sets are each lacking a different vital component that our flagship application requires. mCOM rather bafflingly doesn’t include a Tree control, and the Bit Component Set is a missing DataGrid component.
My long term hopes for a quality component set actually lies with ActionStep. The architecture requires a bit of a paradigm shift, but it doesn’t take long to get used to it. I only wish I had the time to help out.
[...] Despues de la esperada salida de Flash 8 ya
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I'm very dissapointed too..i was waiting for, at least, performance
David | Thursday, 15 September 2005 | 3:48 pmI’m very dissapointed too..i was waiting for, at least, performance improvements (when working on large projects, i’m tired of “Exporting Flash Movie…”)
And the “Normal Mode” of the Actionscript window, let me say, (they put it as an excelent new feature) really really really sucks!!
Flex? I prefer Openlaszlo because I am poor. not sure
Mohawke | Friday, 09 December 2005 | 4:52 pmFlex? I prefer Openlaszlo because I am poor. not sure about componants, but I would think Laszlo has similar goodies as Flex. http://www.openlaszlo.org/
Off subject a tad
I am playing with mtasc, swfmill (which brought me here), and have been using this Python coded scintilla based ActionScript editor SePy. If you haven’t used it I highly recommend giving it a try. http://www.sephiroth.it/python/sepy.php
Of course it’s free…
I am going to have a nervous breakdown with Macromedia
Jaclyn | Wednesday, 04 January 2006 | 5:03 pmI am going to have a nervous breakdown with Macromedia Flash 8 because I cannot even uninstall it. I have tried everything that the support center had to offer and nothing worked. Everytime I do uninstall it, it reinstalls itself. I absolutely hate it
[...] Underwhelmed by Macromedia Flash 8 at Dynamic Flash [...]
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a foos discussion of flash 1.
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